Matt Holliday to the Giants?
by Matt Buggenhagen on Jun 23, 2009 11:47 AM EDT
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PrintAccording to a report in the San Jose Mercury News, Oakland A's Slugger Matt Holiday may be on Giants GM Brian Sabean short list of players to acquire.
Asked whether he would be interested in the A' slugger Sabean had this to say, " I can't answer that. But I will say the list is more right-handed than left-handed."
However, it still remains to be seen whether A's GM Billy Beane would be willing to trade Holliday to another Bay Area rival.
Most people assume that Beane acquired Holliday with the intention of making him a trade piece at this year's deadline. With that being said, Beane is certainly expected to ask for a lot in return.
Holliday who is owed $13.5 million this year, would likely command at least two high quality prospects in the eyes of Beane.
Holliday has had a relatively quite year since leaving the friendly confines of Coors Field; he is batting .270 with eight homers and 39 RBIs.
The A's are currently 31-38, but still only remain 6 ½ games behind the first place Texas Rangers.
I would expect Holliday to be on the move prior to the deadline, but don't expect this to be a salary dump for the A's.
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Holliday
I have to say I am tired of all the trade talk about Matt Holliday. Ever since he joined the A’s, Holliday has been on the trade block.
I don’t see the Giants trading for Holliday. Beane will want either Bumgardner or Alderson and I think that would be too much to ask for.
The only way I could part with Alderson is if the Giants could extend Holliday immediately, but with Boras, there is no chance. I dont see a deal getting done.
The artist formerly known as Set-up man
Billy Beane will trade Holliday to ANYONE who offers the right package regardless of where they are located.
The only reason he got him was to flip him in July. He never intended to resign him IMO.
"I've had pretty good success with Stan Musial by throwing him my best pitch and backing up third." - Carl Erskine
If the Giants are serious & want to make a run.
I can see an Alderson, Neal, +1 more for M. Holliday & A. Kennedy.
Absolutely not
Sabean would be tarred and feathered by the Giants faithful if he were so stupid as to make that trade.
Sergio Romo: striking out professional hitters since 2005. And winner of the 2012 NL Fireman of the Year Award!
Hell No
That would be a horrible deal for the Giants. You are over valuing your player. Maybe if you give us one of your best prospects instead of Kennedy you have a deal. But that is a crazy deal for us to make.
by Michael Uhlhorn on Jun 23, 2009 7:16 PM EDT up reply actions
So what you guys are saying
Is you don’t want Holliday or Kennedy? I’m not directly comparing Holliday with Sabathia but I would expect a similar package in return. A top tier prospect 2 secondary prospects(CC got 13). He will yield 2 picks if you don’t resign him. Kennedy is better than anything you’ve got at 2nd and will be a nice table setter for Sandoval, Holliday and Molina. I guess its a question of whether or not you want to win the World Series. I personally don’t see too many better options out there for the Giants, but I could be wrong.
You guys are dreaming if you think you could get DeRosa or Cantu for some leftover prospect junk btw.
by AthleticsReign on Jun 23, 2009 7:45 PM EDT up reply actions
not to speak for "us"
but “we” probably aren’t going to win a world series by getting Adam Kennedy.
And if there’s no better option than giving up two or three of the prospects that the Giants have lacked for so many years- Matt Holliday can plan on a nice Oktoberfest at the Coliseum.
Giants pitching coach Dave Righetti. "I treat Timmy differently from most pitchers: I leave him alone."
There's 3 ways to do something: the right way, the wrong way, and the Max Power/ Ginats Way...
by natteringnabob on Jun 23, 2009 8:00 PM EDT up reply actions
I think most Giants fans, realistically, realize that even w/ Holliday and Kennedy, they probably won’t be that strong of contenders for the World Series and would rather not mortgage that much of the future for two players who are going to be free agents at the end of the year.
Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.
PABLO SANDOVAL AM STEAL DEATH, DESTROYER OF WORLDS.
Yes, and I want a forever young Betty Page in French maid outfit to serve me diner and cold beverages while I watch the game. I am also sure someone else out there wants a unicorn as well.
Now that is out of the way for a combined 4-8 months of service time you want several years. You do realize the Giants window is not closing? Heck that window of opportunity has barely cracked enough yet to be considered open.
Yes, This is still a 79 win squad.
Where is my beer & chili dog?
My personal view
which I know not everyone is going to agree with is if you have a strong chance. Which the Giants do right now you go for it. I’m not saying completely mortgage the future. But deal from a position of strength. Prospects are just that, they can be stars, regulars, role players, or never were players. I know how we all love our prospects cause I know I do. But need I remind you of Jesse Foppert? Greg Miller? Weren’t they the best pitching prospects in baseball a few years back? I mean Bumgarner could blow out his elbow his next start and never see the light of a major league ball park.
by AthleticsReign on Jun 23, 2009 8:35 PM EDT up reply actions
I guess I don’t agree that the Giants have a strong chance. To most Giants fans, I think contending this year has been a pleasant surprise, as most people weren’t expecting it to happen until 2011 or so. Just because it is happening, however, doesn’t mean the Giants should jump the gun on the rebuilding process they have going.
Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.
PABLO SANDOVAL AM STEAL DEATH, DESTROYER OF WORLDS.
Bumgarner could blow out his elbow, but he could also win a cy young, while Holliday could get hurt in an odd leaf blowing accident. Look, Sabean won’t give up one of his best prospects for a rental. I hope so at least.
by hawaiiconnect on Jun 23, 2009 8:53 PM EDT up reply actions
Signed,
Francisco Liriano, Boof Bonser, and Joe Nathan.
"I’m Joey Devine, I’m what Joba Chamberlain would be if he was good and nobody had ever heard of him."
That trade isn't nearly as bad as people claim it is
In play, run(s)! Talk dirty to me gamecast, talk dirty. - Nevermoor on FK
by designatedforassignment on Jun 24, 2009 3:26 PM EDT up reply actions
are you sure?
Minor White > Ansel Adams
by say hey nation on Jun 24, 2009 7:43 PM EDT up reply actions
If you were talking about longer team control on Holiday then this starts being a reasonable risk. The reality is 2 fold.
1) The Giants chances to get into the post season only get stronger in the next 2-4 season if they keep playing the hand already have.
2) No one else is going to lock up the NL West for the next several seasons.
If the Giants had an older core there is more urgency. If the Giants had a small payroll (say the pre ’97 teams) there is pressure make a move whenever you can because you will most likely not be able to retain and the star that are nearing free agency. Neither of these last two conditions apply to the ’09 Giants.
As for the TINSNAP that cut both ways. You pile up as many exceptional young arms you can because you never know when one your top of the rotation guys can get hurt or just have bad season. The DBacks and Webb are current post child for this. As poorly as things have gone for the Dback if they have Webb making starts instead Buckner, Petit & Augenstine the Dback are probably right in there with the the Giants and the Rockies.
Yes, This is still a 79 win squad.
Where is my beer & chili dog?
What you should understand
The Giants’ chances for the World Series this year are not strong, they are slim. If Holliday and Kennedy were raking (which they aren’t), the chances would get better, but they still wouldn’t be great.
You have to realize that we’ve sat through at least two and arguably four years that should have been rebuilding years, but instead they were “Add some vets and go for it” years. That’s not just in retrospect. And this followed a long run of “Not quite good enough.” Most of us are invested enough to root for a run of great chances than one so-so one.
"[Greg] Vaughn is in a funk so deep, George Clinton wearing a miner's helmet couldn't find him."
- Jim Baker, ESPN.com, May 2002
by achiappanza on Jun 24, 2009 10:59 AM EDT up reply actions
Sabean's contract does expire after '09
He has a club option for 2010, but it hasn’t been exercised yet.
He might want to impress by getting the Giants into the playoffs so he keeps his job, especially since we won’t know how the prospects pan out until way later and thus that wouldn’t be a point to judge him on just yet.
And the service time argument is the gist of all rental trades. You’re getting a small amount, a few months, of near-guaranteed MLB performance time now in exchange for several years of unguaranteed performance time.
"You end up with a name like ‘Outman,’" he said last week. "What else are you going to do? You’re going to get people out, man." ~ Dallas Braden
"JACK! (Hannahan) You gotta stand in there and get the HBP! Your OBP will go from disgusting to merely deplorable if you develop that tactic." ~ Joey C.
Sabes has also said that for the sake of doing a job right and for future job interests he wouldn’t be willing to mortgage the team’s future for a self-interested playoff run.
Rafael Rodriguez: #8 on our list, n/a on a stat sheet.
BBk supports Sleepy's Law: "As a hoops discussion grows longer, the probability of an absurd trade proposal involving LeBron James approaches 1."
ha ha. you have a crack smoking problem.
Neal before Zod!
Official Sponsor of the 1997 San Francisco Giants
by nostocksjustbonds on Jun 23, 2009 7:58 PM EDT up reply actions
LOL riiiight
Now look at me. I'm wet nurse to a last-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!
by zodiac_chiller on Jun 24, 2009 1:18 AM EDT up reply actions
I hope beane gets some young infielders if he trades Holliday.
I think he should trade for needs and not just the best available players.
You have to include smiley faces - Poppy
;- ) :- ) :-O : -> : -] : -}
The market has this whole thing wrong
Everyone expects Beane to deal Holliday, and they expect that we’re “afraid” to offer arbitration in case he accepts. The stupidity that floats around his availability is stunning.
not to say he won't be traded
he most certainly will – assuming the A’s aren’t in contention and the right package is offered. If the A’s are in it (and the young arms are holding up), I wouldn’t be surprised to see Holliday stick through the end of the season and be offered arbi. No way he accepts, but even if he does – oh no – the A’s have a power bat in the middle of their lineup for one more season. They can afford his contract for one more year.
I agree the market is misperceived
…but I see it differently. There has been a sea change in the last few years in how GM’s view their young prospects – quite simply, those prospects have increased in perceived value. As such, no GM in their right mind (one has no idea of Sabean’s mind) would now trade away 2 or 3 top prospects for a hitter who was previously helped greatly by the Coors Field Effect.
Again, how many GM’s are not in their right mind will be seen over the next 5 weeks. But I would presume that Billy Beane will be disappointed in the offers he gets.
Sergio Romo: striking out professional hitters since 2005. And winner of the 2012 NL Fireman of the Year Award!
noava22 +1000000
Why do people think Beane should give Holliday away for trash, when he could get 2 good picks for him! It is Beane’s job to build the A’s and not the giants! Beane needs to get a stud back or hold on to Holliday!
It all depends on where the A's are at come July-All star break-trade deadline
The A’s hang on to Holliday if they are challenging for the division title, trade him if they are not. Simple as that, nothing more, nothing less. The only way Holliday goes if the A’s are “in it” is if someone knocks Beane sideways with an offer and I really don’t see that happening.
Zeigler to Geren…."A-Rod? He’s my bitch." -alox
I can’t see the Giants giving up any of their top 5 prospects (Posey, MadBum, AnVil, Alderson & Noonan) for half a year of Holliday-I HOPE that Sabean learned his lesson with the Shea Hillenbrand fiasco.
Grab Some Pine Meat!
Really?
You cite the Hillenbrand trade? Have you heard of Joe Nathan?
Minor White > Ansel Adams
by say hey nation on Jun 23, 2009 7:39 PM EDT up reply actions
Both fine examples of why Sabean no longer says he drafts only pitchers because they’re easier to trade for position players. At least this last time they branched out a little.
"[Greg] Vaughn is in a funk so deep, George Clinton wearing a miner's helmet couldn't find him."
- Jim Baker, ESPN.com, May 2002
by achiappanza on Jun 24, 2009 11:02 AM EDT up reply actions
I could see them dealing Noonan..
The other 4 though have been marketed so hard this year, they would lose face if they dealt any of them.
Brandon Crawford: Your SF Giants 2011 Opening Day starting SS!
Hillenbrand Trade
Well I was comparing the Hillenbrand Trade to trading for Holliday because they traded for Shea in the middle of the year when they got a whole year out of AJ-although the AJ trade was definitely worse especially considering they had Francisco Liriano & Boof Bonser and after Nathan was traded they had to suffer through Armando Benitez
Grab Some Pine Meat!
Sabean didn’t really give up a top 10 prospect in the Hillenbrand trade though. It’s one of my least favorite Giants trades of the last 6 years but I don’t think it would be analogous to giving up Posey/Bumgarner/Alderson for a guy like Holliday. You’re talking about much higher caliber players all around.
Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.
PABLO SANDOVAL AM STEAL DEATH, DESTROYER OF WORLDS.
That trade is an epitome why us Giants’ fans hate , fear and loathe Sabean on a must buy mission. The critical difference here though is there is no fading Bonds on this ( the ’09 ) team to "force" the Giants’ front office to try and get into the post season this year before he completely fades.
Yes, This is still a 79 win squad.
Where is my beer & chili dog?
Accardo may not have been a top 10 prospect but the Giants certainly could’ve used him when Armando was blowing games left & right, especially given the fact that he was still really young at the time.
Grab Some Pine Meat!
Believe me, no one as more pissed off than I was at that trade and it turned out horribly, but I don’t think going, “Hopefully Sabean learned his lesson from trading the relief prospect who’s had one good year!” makes sense when you’re talking about a totally different level of a trade.
Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.
PABLO SANDOVAL AM STEAL DEATH, DESTROYER OF WORLDS.
The Giants could add the 2007 Matt Holliday
And still not finish .500. That lineup is a negative WAR wasteland.
by All Shook Down on Jun 23, 2009 10:37 PM EDT reply actions
The Giants could add nobody and finish .500, negative WAR bats and all. They were projected for 76-79 wins and have had surprising seasons from the rotation and bullpen.
by thethrillisgone on Jun 24, 2009 10:38 AM EDT up reply actions
*checks standings
Rafael Rodriguez: #8 on our list, n/a on a stat sheet.
BBk supports Sleepy's Law: "As a hoops discussion grows longer, the probability of an absurd trade proposal involving LeBron James approaches 1."
Checks third order standings
32-38
Lincecum has been otherworldly and Cain has been great. Zito and Johnson have held that rotation down and have been backed by an outstanding bullpen. I can’t deny any of those facts. It’s just that everyone on the offensive end — outside of Sandoval — have performed worse than expected and that’s something one middle-of-the-order bat can not overcome.
by All Shook Down on Jun 24, 2009 6:48 PM EDT up reply actions
All I’m saying is predictive stats are good to forecast but at some point you actually have to play the games. To this point, while they haven’t scoring a prolific amount of runs but they’ve been scoring enough to rely on their strengths and scratch off more wins than any of us could have predicted.
All we really have to go on for this team is what they’ve done so far and so far they’re seven games above .500.
Rafael Rodriguez: #8 on our list, n/a on a stat sheet.
BBk supports Sleepy's Law: "As a hoops discussion grows longer, the probability of an absurd trade proposal involving LeBron James approaches 1."
A trade being thrown around on AN
Is Holliday, Kennedy, and a bullpen arm like Weurtz for Brandon Crawford, Thomas Neal, maybe an arm like Claton Tanner. I think thats reasonable. A’s get two decent prospects to justify giving up draft pick compensation. The Giants keep their big four prospects (Posey, Villalona, Alderson, Bumgardner), fill their three biggest holes, AND potentially get two picks for Holliday. Thats pretty win-win.
"May our feet be swift. May our bats be mighty. And may our balls be...plentiful."
by nothinlikethetown on Jun 24, 2009 7:09 AM EDT reply actions
That doesn't make any sense for Oakland.
Adding to Holliday in order to get prospects that aren’t top tier?
"I’m Joey Devine, I’m what Joba Chamberlain would be if he was good and nobody had ever heard of him."
AN is lame board thank god for daily dish
I think the A’s should move Holliday to SF if it’s the best package if they want Adam Kennedy too that’s fine he should get a nice deal on the open market. Oakland may not spend the coin on him any even if the Giants rent him for the rest of the year we could still sign him.
by A'Seahawks_Warriors on Jun 24, 2009 4:52 PM EDT reply actions
Holliday to the Giants
I would be hesitant to trade for Holliday if he were not under contract for longer than this year. Beane will want some good young (cheap) players, including prospects, from the Giants for Holliday and will not be satisfied with Fred Lewis and Jonathan Sanchez. I think the cost to the Giants future would take a hit to just rent Holliday. I would like Sabean to take a different approach to building the team than just selling the future like he has done for many years. This could be a tough decision. Not sure I would want to make it, but as a fan, I will have to live with it.
Secondary issue: would you want to play for the A’s when you may make some Major League pay, but feel like it is a AAA team and that you are on a shelf with a price tag around your neck for shoppers to consider all of the time?
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