Phillies Complete Trade for Cliff Lee
by Brendan Scolari on Jul 29, 2009 1:52 PM EDT
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PrintThe Indians have agreed to trade Cliff Lee and Ben Francisco to the Phillies for Carlos Carrasco, Jason Knapp, Jason Donald, and Lou Marson according to Ken Rosenthal and Jon Paul Morosi of FOXSports.com. Here's their explanation of the deal from each side's perspective:
The Phillies would get Lee without giving up any of the three players the Blue Jays initially wanted for Halladay — left-hander J.A. Happ, right-hander Kyle Drabek and outfielder Dominic Brown.
Francisco would fill the Phillies' longstanding need for a right-handed hitter off the bench. Lee would give the Phillies four left-handed starters, along with Cole Hamels, J.A. Happ and Jamie Moyer. But Happ or Moyer could go to the bullpen once right-hander Pedro Martinez is ready to pitch in the majors.
The Indians, meanwhile, would get four of the Phillies' top 10 prospects according to Baseball America's pre-season rankings. Carrasco was rated second, Marson third, Donald fourth and Knapp 10th.
I think it seems like a huge win fo the Phillies. they get the reigning Cy Young award winner and don't have to give up Kyle Drabek or J.A Happ.
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WOW
I’m really interested to see Lee’s production on a really good team. He has pitched much better than his numbers indicate. Phillies are going to be tough to beat in the NL.
by Matt Buggenhagen on Jul 29, 2009 1:55 PM EDT reply actions
Anyone else notice
that Happ, Brown and Drabek are still on the Phils….
You think??? Go after Halladay too. Its pos…nah…Uh oh…
Whos the ace?
Hamels or Lee?
for a playoff rotation they probably go Hamels, Myers, Lee and Blanton.
Dodgers go after Halladay now? Can they match what was asked for from the Phils? McDonald, Elbert, Lambo and a piece or two could match…
Myers is out for the season.
And I don’t think the Blue Jays would agree to a package like that, it seems like they want a ton in return.
by Brendan Scolari on Jul 29, 2009 2:20 PM EDT up reply actions
Maybe
The Brewers would give the Phils Jeff Suppan then….for a bag of peanuts.
I did not know about Myers. Thank you for the update.
Decent haul for Lee; Halladay and Jays left hanging?
I don’t think the Dodgers have the pieces to get Halladay. Billingsley would need to be included (last I heard, Dodgers have said Kershaw is untouchable.) Right now, the best offer for Halladay is coming from the Red Sox, and we’ll see if Toronto moves him within the division, holds him for the rest of the season, or sells low now that the Phillies are left the market.
Indians didn’t do bad. Until this year, Carrrasco was rated as a much better prospect than either Drabek or Happ. He was their #1 prospect in ‘07 and ’08, but has struggled this year in AAA, with an ERA of 5+. But the Indians ended up with the BA ’09 #2 (Carrasco), #3 (Marson), #4 (Donald) and #10 (Knapp) prospects from the Phillies. That’s not too shabby.
thats
thats the players they offered and we said no to the blue jays .. that being said they cant get halldady .. they just traded half our prospects and cant take on more salary
by jack is better than asante on Jul 29, 2009 3:52 PM EDT up reply actions
This will be very helpful in the playoffs
I think the Phillies are the favorite to be NL champs now.
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Both side win trades
Otherwise trades would not be made.
I wonder if this now means that LaPorta is going to get called up.
As a Rays fan
Not thrilled with this one. If the Rays actually offered Davis and Brignac as rumored, then I think the Indians made a mistake going with the Phillies.
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rays
if your going to trade wade davis and braignac for lee thats stupid .. you can get halladay with that package
by jack is better than asante on Jul 29, 2009 3:54 PM EDT up reply actions
Great blockbuster deal
the indians got a lot of good prospects but the Phillies got a great pitcher and a ok 4th outfielder, great deal
Carlos Guillen, the Latino Punto
I think this was a very even trade.
But as a Phillies fan I am excited. Lee with this offense behind him should be awesome. We gave up a fair bounty, but Donald’s path was blocked by JRoll and Utley and Carrasco has good “stuff” but seems to not have it together between the ears. I would have loved to see Marson up to tandem with Ruiz, but I think it was a good, even trade.
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Halladay vs Lee
To answer one posted question, it is still possible for the Phillies to get Halladay (with Happ and Drabek), but it’s not going to happen. There’s no need on the Phillies side.
It’s a good trade. Phillies may not have given up any impact players, and Donald was blocked by Rollins. Carrasco’s value has dropped quite a bit this season, while both Happ and Drabek have outperformed pre-season expectations.
But Lee isn’t exactly a sure thing either, and there’s a reason why Halladay’s price was so steep. Counting this season, in the past 9 seasons Doc has had an ERA < 3.14 and been under 3.75 8 of those 9 seasons, been 3.25 or better in 7 of the past 9 seasons.. His worst year in the past 9 was a 4.20 ERA. That is consistency. His career ERA is 3.45.
Lee’s career ERA is just over 4.0, and he was much better #‘s last season in BB/9 (1.37 almost half his career avg 2.6), WHIP (1.11 vs career avg 1.31) and in HR/9 (0.48 less than half his career avg of 1.02). Until last season, he hadn’t had a season with an ERA < 3.75 except for his 50 inning rookie year in ’03. He still has the 2nd best ERA of his career this year, but his BB/9 and HR/9 are much higher compared to last year, thought still better than his career avgs. (BB/9 = 2.0, HR/9 = 0.6).
In other words, he’s no Halladay. But I think the Phils decided that they’d rather have 3 potential SPs with 3.5 ERAs (Lee, Happ, Drabek), then 1 Halladay with a 3.0 ERA.
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