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Joe Torre Comments on Steroid-Tainted Stars

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Joe Torre made some interesting remarks about the crop of Hall of Fame-caliber, now tainted players yesterday. He said in looking at the whole of the careers of players like Barry Bonds, Roger Clemens, Manny Ramirez and Alex Rodriguez, " I feel, ability-wise, there were players that were-cheating aside, Barry Bonds is a Hall of Fame type player, because before anyone questioned him about anything, he won four MVPs. And there are very few guys who win four MVPs who aren't in the Hall of Fame. Now that doesn't mean he should be in the Hall of Fame. I'm not saying that." Torre went on, "Pete Rose, and that has nothing to do with steroids-he's not in the Hall of Fame and he certainly has the credentials to be in the Hall of Fame. I think Clemens, I think Manny, I think Alex and all those people are in that upper group of guys that, ability-wise, with steroids stuff aside,I think are legitimate players to begin with."

I'm not exactly sure what Torre was trying to say here.  It sounds like he is saying their careers would have been Hall of Fame-worthy without the steroid use. That is probably true but when he lumps them in with gambler-cheater Pete Rose, he underscores that cheating is cheating.